Apologetics Forum: Ask questions about Christianity/Debate doctrinesBeware of this Different Gospel of ChristI keep carrying on this discussion in an attempt to make you think instead of parroting a doctrine that Paul did not teach. John wrote his gospel about 30 years after Paul died, so how can you reconcile what Paul wrote with the doctrine of the Trinity? After all Paul wrote this to the Corinthians: 1 Corinthians 8:5-6 5 For even if there are so-called gods whether in heaven or on earth, as indeed there are many gods and many lords, 6 yet for us there is but one God, the Father, from whom are all things, and we exist for Him; and one Lord, Jesus Christ, by whom are all things, and we exist through Him. NAS And Paul wrote this to Timothy: 1 Timothy 2:4-7 5 For there is one God, and one mediator also between God and men, the man Christ Jesus, 6 who gave Himself as a ransom for all, the testimony borne at the proper time. 7 And for this I was appointed a preacher and an apostle (I am telling the truth, I am not lying) as a teacher of the Gentiles in faith and truth. NAS How do you go from one God, one mediator, and one man to one God/man who is part of a plural Godhead that is 3 not 1? The answer is by interpreting John 1:1-15 and a few other Scriptures to show that Jesus (who was born of a woman in about 2 B.C.) existed before the beginning. How did 1st century Jews and Greeks understand the concept of "logos"? Have you researched and studied this or simply accepted what other men have taught you? 2 Timothy 2:15 15 Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.KJV So lets do a bit of study shall we? Philo of Alexandria was a Hellenistic Jew and a philosopher. Here is a link to an article concerning Philo and the logos found in the Jewish Encyclopedia: What did John have in mind when he used the word "logos"? God's divine plan for mankind that existed before the beginning, which became flesh and dwelled among us. This John 10:10 is how 1st century Jews as well as Greeks would have understood John's prologue. The plan for the Son was eternal, the Son was not eternal. Jesus' own words cast doubt on the doctrine of the Trinity. John 17:3 And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent. KJV Isaiah 9:6-7 6 For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counseller, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace. 7 Of the increase of his government and peace there shall be no end, upon the throne of David, and upon his kingdom, to order it, and to establish it with judgment and with justice from henceforth even for ever. The zeal of the LORD of hosts will perform this. KJV Isaiah 9:6 is one OT prophecy that is used to try to prove the Trinity. However, look at those titles. Wonderful Counselor is the Holy Spirit, mighty God and everlasting Father are God the Father, and The Prince of Peace is the Son and all are included in a name not a person. This verse does not prove a Trinity is shows the oneness of God. Who is the Holy Spirit? The Holy Spirit is God who is spirit, not a seperate person in a triune Godhead. We are sealed with the Creator when we believe we are not sealed by a seperate entity that is a seperate person from the Father. Deuteronomy 5:6-7 6'I am the LORD your God, who brought you out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of slavery. 7'You shall have no other gods before Me. NAS Deuteronomy 6:4 4 "Hear, O Israel! The LORD is our God, the LORD is one! NAS YHWY is our elohiym, YHWY is one, not three. |
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