Aineo wrote:Brad, is Jesus the suffering Messiah of the OT? If you can say yes then find me one OT verse that so plainly states this fact that any reasonable Hebrew should accept Jesus Christ as the prophesied Messiah.
Are you saying there is none?
You have chosen to ignore my question so I guess I need to rephrase it. Your main argument against the Trinity is the lack of a single verse in Scripture that states the one God is revealed as 3 persons so I asked you to show me one OT Scripture that any Hebrew could understand to state Jesus is the suffering Messiah. What you have done is appeal to the NT.
You are really caught up in a "revolving door" here. You're arguing against using specific verses to establish a truth, yet you QUOTE SPECIFIC VERSES to establish salvation by grace alone in your example??????
Now I'm at the point of wondering if this is all just a "put on" on your part? Are you really serious, or are you a non-Trinitarian posing as a Trinitarian to make them (Trinitarians) look foolish? I'm not trying to be insulting, but can anyone blame me for wondering how anyone would seriously say what you did in your other post - that I choose to ignore what is taught in scripture because I can't find even one verse that teaches it?
You really are being obtuse. I quoted Scripture that plainly states we are saved by grace through faith. Now read Hisway’s posts that attempt to show that faith without works is dead shows that we are not saved by faith alone. He is among many who deny the simple truth of Scripture by interpreting James as contradicting Paul.
But back to your original premise that Trinitarians are in fact polytheistic.
There is only ONE GOD who has revealed Himself in 3 roles in the NT. These roles are Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. All three make up the ONE GOD and each person (role) has all the characteristics, attributes, and abilities of the other. Why would God who is spirit need the Holy Spirit if God were ONE? It is illogical for the Moses to write:
Genesis 1:1-2
1:1 In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth. 2 And the earth was formless and void, and darkness was over the surface of the deep; and the Spirit of God was moving over the surface of the waters. NAS
What is logical is to write “and God was moving over the surface of the waters”. So with the first 2 verses of Genesis we have the precursor of the Trinity.
Exodus 33:19-20
20 But He said, "You cannot see My face, for no man can see Me and live!" NAS
Now one question you and other non-Trinitarians have danced around is who did Abraham entertain in Genesis 18?
Genesis 18:1
18:1 Now the LORD appeared to him by the oaks of Mamre, while he was sitting at the tent door in the heat of the day. NAS
The word LORD in this verse is the Hebrew:
OT:3068
Yehovah (yeh-ho-vaw'); from OT:1961; (the) self-Existent or Eternal; Jehovah, Jewish national name of God:
KJV - Jehovah, the Lord. Compare OT:3050, OT:3069.
(Biblesoft's New Exhaustive Strong's Numbers and Concordance with Expanded Greek-Hebrew Dictionary. Copyright (c) 1994, Biblesoft and International Bible Translators, Inc.)
John 6:46
46 "Not that any man has seen the Father, except the One who is from God; He has seen the Father. NAS
John 14:8-9
8 Philip said to Him, "Lord, show us the Father, and it is enough for us." 9 Jesus said to him, "Have I been so long with you, and yet you have not come to know Me, Philip? He who has seen Me has seen the Father; how do you say, 'Show us the Father'? NAS